CNBC专访文远知行创始人兼CEO韩旭：自动驾驶将像电灯一样“点亮”全世界

2月28日，文远知行创始人兼CEO韩旭接受全球顶尖财经电视新闻媒体CNBC专访，在《Street Signs Asia》栏目上就公司全球商业化战略、自动驾驶技术的社会影响进行了分享和讨论。

以下为访谈全文实录。

CNBC： Tony Han, the CEO of WeRide, joins us now for CNBC exclusive interview and we are very glad that he could make the time to be with us this morning. Tony, thank you very much. Please explain the expansion strategy and what you hope to achieve from it.

今天我们很高兴邀请到文远知行CEO Tony Han接受CNBC的独家专访。Tony，感谢您抽出时间，请介绍一下文远知行此次国际拓展的战略（2月28日文远知行宣布部署欧洲首个纯无人小巴商业运营项目）以及期望通过这个项目实现的目标。

Tony Han： The collaboration with beti, Macif and Renault Group is a kind of unprecedented collaboration. And this is to my best knowledge, the first fully operational high-level autonomous driving shuttle deployed in a daily base. And to us, this is our first step to the European region. And also, I do believe this is a great movement because, think about the main purpose of developing autonomous driving technology, (it) is trying to make transportation safer, more efficient and more comfortable. if you have ever taken a ride in our autonomous driving bus, it's like a private cabinet and it's very comfortable. We want to really revolutionize the public transportation. It not only stands for economically efficient but should also stand for very comfortable and much safer. And we know Europe is currently an aging society and we are facing a bus driver shortage problem together. So, we want to use cutting-edge autonomous driving technology to make public transportation upgrade services for all human societies. Therefore, doing some business with autonomous driving technology and collaborating with beti, Macif and Renault Group becomes a great first step.

这次与beti、Macif及雷诺集团的携手是一次前所未有的合作。据我所知，这是欧洲首个正式投入商业化日常运营的自动驾驶接驳服务。对我们而言，这是进入欧洲市场的重要一步。我相信这是一个重大的进展，因为我们开发自动驾驶技术的初衷就是为了让交通更加安全、高效和舒适。如果你坐过我们的自动驾驶小巴，会发现它就像一个私人座舱，极具舒适性。我们希望变革公共交通，使其既经济高效，又兼具舒适度与安全性。

我们知道，欧洲是一个老龄化社会，正面临司机短缺的问题。我们希望通过先进的自动驾驶技术，为社会提供更优质的公共交通服务。因此，与beti、Macif及雷诺集团在自动驾驶商业化上的合作是重要的第一步。

CNBC： Tony, you have partnered up with European companies in order to make these inroads into Europe. I'm just wondering how you're navigating some of the geopolitical challenges that Chinese companies are facing over there. I mean, it very much speaks to, I think, what you’re doing. Some of the views out there that this is exactly how it's going to be is that we're going to see more companies across Europe and China partnering up and teaming up in order to address exactly what you're talking about. But I'm just wondering how you are navigating some of those challenges with regards to Europe and the pressure from the EU.

Tony，你们选择与欧洲企业合作来进入欧洲市场。我很好奇，您是如何应对当前中国企业在欧洲面临的地缘政治挑战的？有观点认为，越来越多欧洲和中国的企业合作起来，以共同应对你刚刚提到的问题。您是如何应对欧洲市场的挑战以及来自欧盟的压力的？

Tony Han： If you look back to the human history, great companies have always been navigat ing across this kind of geopolitical tensions. There’re some stories I want to share with you. Thomas Edison invented the light bulb, but the light bulb is not only lighting (up) America but also lighting (up) the rest of the world. And you know, human society has experienced the World War. And I'm personally I'm a pacifist and I think to navigate this kind of geopolitical tension and in the current era, it's like we are facing together. To do business in any region like in European countries, in MENA countries, in southeast Asian countries, you have to comply with all addressable regulations and laws and also really contribute to the local society. That's our philosophy. We are doing business all over the world, but we do respect the local society, and want to help the economic development of the local society. The most important thing is that we want to make this very, very helpful autonomous driving technology available to the rest of the world.

回顾人类历史，伟大的企业总能在地缘政治的紧张局势中找到发展之道。我想分享一个例子：托马斯·爱迪生发明了电灯泡，但电灯泡不仅照亮了美国，也照亮了整个世界。

人类社会曾经历世界大战，我个人是一个和平主义者，我认为当今时代在地缘政治的紧张局势中寻求突破，这是我们所共同面对的。无论是在欧洲国家、中东北非国家，还是东南亚国家做生意，你都需要遵守当地的法律法规，并真正为当地社会贡献价值。这是我们的理念。我们在全球发展业务，我们尊重当地市场，并且助力当地经济发展。最重要的一点，我们希望让这项非常有用的自动驾驶技术惠及全球。

CNBC： Tony, I just want to talk a little bit about Nvidia's interest in your company. It’s not like they just came in a few weeks ago, but they have been an early investor, so they've backed your business from the start. And obviously they upped the stake that they had in your business, which led to that massive rally in your stock. What have your discussions with Jensen Huang been in terms of this autonomous driving technology? And what's your pitch been to him and what's his expectation from your company in terms of where you want to take it?

Tony，我想聊聊英伟达对你们公司的兴趣。他们并不是几周前才开始关注你们，而是你们的早期投资人，从一开始就支持你们的业务。显然，他们加大了在你们公司的投资，这让你们的股票获得了巨大的上涨。你和黄仁勋关于自动驾驶技术的讨论是怎么样的？你向他提出的计划是什么，他对你们公司未来发展的期望是什么？

Tony Han： I have been known Jensen since the beginning of this company in the year of 2017. At that time, I was at Silicon Valley. I think Jensen is a great entrepreneur, always pushing for the great technology. At that time, WeRide is one of the best autonomous driving technology companies and we didn't have any actual real business. What we only had is our great technology. I think because of the advancement of our technology and our demonstration, and Jensen made his mind to invest us. And then later, maybe seven years later, people know Nvidia is our shareholder. To us, we have a big dream to make this company a great company and we really want to revolutionize the transportation with autonomous driving technology. To my mind, I think driving is a tedious job. And it can be a hobby, but it shouldn't be a task. And replacing the tedious job with machine is what our researchers or entrepreneurs are trying to do. Therefore, I think we will continue pursuing excellence in technology and gradually make this technology available to the transportation business.

我与黄仁勋的结识可以追溯到 2017 年公司刚成立的时候。当时我还在硅谷。我认为黄仁勋是一位伟大的企业家，他始终追求伟大的技术进步。

当时，文远知行是全球最好的自动驾驶科技公司之一，但没有任何实际落地的业务，只有技术。我认为是我们技术的先进性让黄仁勋决定投资我们。七年之后，大家得知英伟达是我们的股东。我们的愿景是把文远知行打造成一家伟大的公司，利用自动驾驶技术变革交通出行。我认为，驾驶是一项繁琐的工作，它可以是一项兴趣，但不应是一项任务。研究者和企业家们正致力于用机器取代这类繁琐的工作。因此，我们会持续追求技术的卓越，并逐渐将其应用到交通出行业务中。

CNBC： So, driving may be a hobby, but for many emerging markets, it's a major source of employment. And so how do you think about that, the displacement of jobs that can lead to if more and more transportation vehicles become autonomous. 驾驶可以是一种乐趣，但在许多新兴市场，它是重要的就业来源。如果越来越多的交通车辆变成自动驾驶，大量工作会被取代，对此您如何看待？

Tony Han： It's a great question. I'm so excited to answer this question. I think in the 21st century, one of the key questions to the philosophers is the relationship between Mankind and the machines, more specifically AI. And there are lots of jobs used to be taken by human being and solve the employment problem, and that will gradually be taken by AI or machines. But think about in history that’s not the first time, like the programmable switch machine replaced the human operators and washing machines replaced laundry workers. Now I think for the mining business, they adopt technology a lot. I'll say it's called a migration or shift of human jobs. To me, I don't want to be a taxi driver, if I have other choices. There are always other jobs available. And I think we should put resource, inject resource, put lots of efforts to find really more amicable and more enjoyable jobs for the working class. I think they are there, for example labelling business, elder care. Also, we want to do this gradually. The key problem for our society, in many aging societies, it’s not because of jobs, but about the shortage of bus drivers or taxi drivers. So, we want to use technology, more specifically, autonomous driving technology to solve this problem.

这个问题非常好，我很高兴有机会来回答。21世纪哲学家思考的一个关键问题就是人与机器的关系，更具体来说是人与人工智能（AI）的关系。许多曾由人完成的工作都逐渐被机器取代。回看历史，这并不是第一次。可编程的交换机取代了人工操作员，洗衣机取代了洗衣工，矿业也大量采用了自动化科技。这是人类工作岗位的迁移或转型。

如果有更好的工作选择，一个人可能并不想当出租车司机。我认为我们应该投入更多资源和努力为人们创造更友好、更愉悦的就业岗位。其实这样的新岗位已经存在了，例如数据标注、老年护理等。同时，这样的岗位迁移是循序渐进的。

其实在很多老龄化社会，关键问题不是就业，而是公交车司机和出租车司机短缺。因此，我们希望利用自动驾驶技术来解决这一问题。

CNBC： I completely understand Tony, where you're coming from. In my mind, the sequence of that AI adoption is first you find the replacement, the re-skilling. You solve that problem. And then displacement would not be disruptive. What's happening is the displacement is coming faster than the replacement.

Tony，我完全理解你的观点。在我看来，人工智能应用的顺序是首先找到替代方案，进行再培训。如果你解决了这个问题，取代就不会造成破坏性影响。而现在的情况是，取代的速度似乎比替代方案的实施更快。

Tony Han： So, that's why you have to control the pace. You don't want to (see that) in one night, every taxi has been replaced with Robotaxi. You don't want to do that. Actually, I think a progressive approach would be good. And so basically you gradually fill up the gap between the demand and the supply. We all face the fact that there is an aging society. We all observe this kind of phenomenon. There's currently a kind of shortage between demand and supply in terms of taxi drivers and bus drivers. Actually, in some societies, it's become very big problem. Look at some countries in Europe and look at Japan. They simply have no bus drivers and taxi drivers and look at their average age. We have to use technology to solve this kind of society problem. And for job replacement, we should do it gradually.

所以我们必须掌握技术应用的节奏。我们不会想看到自动驾驶出租车在一夜之间取代所有传统出租车。我们不想做这样的事。我认为渐进式策略是一个好的选择。我们做的是逐渐去填补供需之间的缺口。我们都面临一个事实，那就是人口老龄化。我们都发现了这个现象。当前出租车司机和公交车司机的供应和需求存在缺口。实际上，在一些社会，这已经成为很大的问题。去看看欧洲的一些国家和日本，他们没有足够的公交车司机和出租车司机，从业人员的平均年龄也很高。我们必须利用科技来解决这一社会问题。至于岗位的取代和转移，我们应该渐进式地进行（而非一夜之间）。

CNBC： OK. Your big markets are China, the US, UAE and Singapore. That's where you hold driverless permits. Samantha already asked you about your political tensions and being caught in the cross of the tensions between China and the US. I'm running out of time. So, very quickly, how do we see growth playing out for your business and which are the key growth markets where you see linearity in growth?

好的。你们的主要市场是中国、美国、阿联酋和新加坡，这是你们持有无人驾驶许可的地方。Samantha刚刚已经问过你关于地缘政治以及中美关系的问题。你如何规划公司业务的增长？在哪些关键市场你们会有线性增长？

Tony Han： So, basically all the aging societies, with a relatively high salary, I mean taxi driver salary. So basically these are our (targeting) markets. To do so, you have to really make your technology safer and make autonomous driving experience very comfortable. So that's what we’re working hard on.

所有老龄化严重且劳动力成本高的市场都是我们的目标市场。我们必须确保技术的安全性，并让自动驾驶体验非常舒适。这是我们正在努力的方向。

CNBC: Good stuff, Tony! Absolute pleasure speaking with you today. Thank you so much for your time and breaking that all down for us.

很好，Tony！今天和您的交流非常愉快。非常感谢您抽出时间为我们解答上述问题。